Western Arrogance at best!

[Bantu_Kelani]

Posted By: Ras Rootka Zebulun
Date: Wednesday, 8 October 2003, at 6:17 p.m.  
In Response To: Irie to see De I still here Rootka (Ninja Ras)  
You know how I stay with this site Ninja Ras. Just can't get caught up with all this talk on Black & White, it's ridiculous to me. Not necessary in Rastafari, we are supposed to be teaching the people not tearing them down with all this prejudice talk. His Majesty taught us African Unity, but also Universal Unity, & that is what I must accept always. Selassie I.  

 
This is an excellent example of western arrogance at work! No, let's not talk about ALL the historical facts of slavery, colonialism, Apartheid and Jim Crow, how we Blacks didn't get to inherit the fruits of our ancestors' labor, whether as individuals or as communities while white, Arab, Jews people are reaping the material and social benefit of Black labor and Black communities.  

NO LET'S NOT TALK "ancient history" Jim Crow was stills a FACT of life up until very recently, and how Black people are still being targeted for enslavement in the prison/industrial complex, let's not talk about it!!  

The very fact that so many western so-called Rastafarians live in a white dominated racist society, and are functionally immune to its racism, creates arrogance/insensitivity. The fact that most of them I suppose whites or near whites are not targeted for police scrutiny and arrest based on their skin color and the fact that their community isn't classed as "sub culture" is white privilege indeed!  

Romantic, delusional white, near white folks well-groomed supremacists are living under the illusion that we live in some kind of meritocracy, a colorblind world or anything resembling. Ah! Eurocentrism again, the most glaring insensitivity of white male privilege has been demonstrated.  


Bantu-Kelani

[Yann]

I FULLY AGREE KELANI!!!!

i am so SICK of that attitude! it is amazing how the same problem keeps coming up over an over. From the threads on supremacy in black movements, colourism, racism and opression in ethiopia, white rastas and the list goes on, we see this same thing. whites and light skinned blacks DECIDING WHAT SHOULD BE ADDRESSED AND WHAT IS IRRELEVANT. that attitude is not only arrogance and superiority but borders on downright rascism. NO ONE can tell black poeple what their issues are or what we should be focussing on. we focus on what is important and what is NECCESSARY to take us foward. all this talk about Selassie telling teaching us universal love is downright nonsense! some of them need to take a closer look at their 'god' and see what 'love' he really acted upon.

the only reason people feel uncomfortable hearing these issues raised is because it challenges thier own complicity with this same white supremacist system.  if they want to remain in thier lily-white illusion it is fine by me. but we will continue to raise the issues. their kicking and screaming is just more proof to me that the ISSUES must CONTINUE TO BE RAISED.

[Bantu_Kelani]

Posted By: Bantu-Kelani
Date: Thursday, 9 October 2003, at 9:15 p.m.

In Response To: Western arrogance by yourself (Ras Rootka Zebulun)

( smile! )

As always the knee-jerk, reflex response of the same individuals here expand my knowledge and understanding of conscious or unconscious prejudiced thoughts with no opinion and argument against logical scrutiny.

The hypocrisy of the so-called Black posters only go to annihilate tough issues of racism, colourism, discriminations displays how western their psychologies continue to carry over to this very moment on this board. Dodging, and ducking conducts are not good because it does not address the CORE issues plaguing Black people. But how would they know? To comprehend such importance they would have to be the most stigmatized, they would have to be BLACKS in the first place..

Their motto includes the word UNITY, to reach that goal entails though, relavant discourse and debates. Instead they see fit to run away with their tails tucked between their legs, blaming those of us who chose deal with real issues. They could have stood up like real men and women and debate the issues, but childish or insincere thinking folks always point out personal attacks, name calling and all of that to IGNORE THE SUBSTANCE of what is being said.

How can we be really sure if anyone here is who they say they are?? The so-called -black posters on this board display white supremacist agenda, uncle Toms playing games detrimental to the advancement of black people as it is. BEING BLACK IS MORE THEN JUST A PHYSICAL APPEARANCE, IT IS A FRAME OF MIND. There is a way to tell who or what a person are on this board, I'm all eyes to see it..

Knowledgeable minds know we the African Immigrants are in the West and not Africa for a reason because they had looked at the reality of Africa. They know how we were living poorly. So what did we do? We had no time to whine, we left the slums of Africa, our parents, our dear villages to come here for opportunities... We fight, we look in all directions trying to climb the ladder of misery. Through thin we still look behind and provide for our people back home.

Who's insincere? Well, there is a subjective criterion for everything.

Peace.

[sisMenenI]

Western arrogance by yourself

(I will post this FOR Ras Rootka Zebulun since he probably didn't get a chance to sight this slanderous post on this Africaspeaks board)

Posted By: Ras Rootka Zebulun
Date: Thursday, 9 October 2003, at 7:32 p.m.

In Response To: Western Arrogance at best! (Bantu-Kelani)

No offense Sister, but this is one of the most ridiculous topics you have posted on this topic here. What is your point? Wha you don't think that I ain't Afrocentric? You don't know me period, because if you did, I am very Afrocentric, I teach my people dread. But there is a difference between you & I, in uplifting my African people, instead of dwelling all the blasted time on slavery. Even Marcus Garvey encouraged us to not focus on slavery too much, but work on building up a United States of Africa, so are you really listening to Marcus Garvey or other people?

I don't know what your intention was to post my topic, but its plain arrogant if you ask me. I think that you are a foolish Black woman, who like other Black people are blaming the white man for every blastid thing they go through. Its simply ridiculous, I rather listen to my teacher, Marcus Garvey, than others about African Unity! Garvey came to uplift his Black people, never did he undermine any race as you & others have done on this site. So I don't pay you people no mind at all, iz Garvey mi deal wit along wit Selassie I! If you knew me, you wouldn't have posted this foolish topic ya. I was born & raised in the Caribbean, & it is in the West Indies where the real revolution took place with the African slaves. Do some research for yourself.

You nor anyone else here can talk all the foolishness you want, I don't pay none of you any mind at all. Most of you who were born here in America, don't really know what Rastafari is to begin with. You just put all these foolish black radical thoughts which is antiGarvey & Selassie, into I n I Rastafari Movement. Do more studying meh son, because I will never agree with what some of you trying to indoctrinate into Rastafari now! If it ain't Selassie or Garvey, mi nuh want hear it taal! Because its the teachings of Haile Selassie I & the philosophies & opinions of Marcus Garvey, mek Rastafari how it is, not any other unnecessary thoughts from some of you Black American people.

That is how I learned Rastafari in the islands & I hope that some of you can learn what the Movement is really about, instead of putting other people's ideologies into Rasta. If you never even experience the livity of Rastafari, then do it, see it for yourself. Live up in the hills like de Rastaman still do, learn what Rastafari is really about. It ain't bout just dreadlocks, reggae, ganja,, but more than that meh son dread. Read Haile Selassie I's exact words & Marcus Garvey's philosophies, & don't put no one else's words, or make up your own ideologies on what the King nor the Prophet never taught for I n I Rastafari people.

For real, some of you Black Americans who claim to be Rastafari, are a joke. You're just a bunch of Rasta symphathizing Black Americans, who joined up different Black radical groups & try to bring these kind of thoughts into I n I Rastafari, creating pure division star! I've heard such foolish ideas from some of you, & that is not what Rastafari is really about! Das why mi always seh, ole skool Rastafari me stay meh son! Selassie I nor Garvey never preach any antiwhite speeches, but I've seen it here on this very site. His Majesty & Brother Marcus, said that they have white friends, but some of you here are nothing but pure racists fe real. Give us the teachings of His Majesty for we nuh want no devil philosophy! Give us the philosophy of Marcus Garvey for I n I only want to hear that great man, Brother Garvey! If it ain't Selassie or Garvey, then its not Rastafari taal. Selassie I! RasTafari!

[Ayinde]

To you this might be an appropriate response and conduct given that the writer professes to "sight Selassie" according to a comment you made the other day. But in my view the response only shows that the initial points raised to his distorted notions were in fact quite legitimate.

Posted By: Ras Rootka Zebulun
Date: Wednesday, 8 October 2003, at 6:17 p.m.  
In Response To: Irie to see De I still here Rootka (Ninja Ras)
You know how I stay with this site Ninja Ras. Just can't get caught up with all this talk on Black & White, it's ridiculous to me. Not necessary in Rastafari, we are supposed to be teaching the people not tearing them down with all this prejudice talk. His Majesty taught us African Unity, but also Universal Unity, & that is what I must accept always. Selassie I.

This is the comment that was challenged, and Rootka Zebulun's initial comment and response clearly shows that he is delusional.

You said that the response by Kelani is slanderous, which I am yet to see, and after reading both responses I see that you are also quite prepared to tolerate and accept any kind of vile delusional conduct once the person "sight Selassie" according to your view. This to me just exposes the real problem even more.

[nmichele]

i don't think it's anyone's place to call anyone else "delusional"...any discussion on race, Rastafari, whatever must be contextualized...situated in socio-cultural and historical context...who are you to call this woman, rasied in the islands and learning Rastafari in that particular context, delusional?  i agree that it is important to address critical issues that plague Black people and raise consciousness...but it is not our right to tell anyone how to go about doing it...if this woman wants to believe in "unity" and "love", then it is her right to do so, as we are all on different social and political journies...

as we are in this process of engaging with one anothers ideas and political views...it's important to take a minute and step outside of ourselves...check ourselves and our politics and how we push those politics on to others without constructive criticism or looking inward...
thanks...nmichele

[Yann]

well actually what kelani called delusional was rootka's seeming belief that the discussion of these tough issues of black on black racism did not need to be discussed over and over again.

Romantic, delusional white, near white folks well-groomed supremacists are living under the illusion that we live in some kind of meritocracy, a colorblind world or anything resembling

the love and peace thing is fine, but when the issues must be sacrificed under so called 'unity'  just to give the pretense of love  etc etc THAT is delusional.  many are offended by this topic as you well know as you raised the fact that people have not been discussing the colourism issue. this is also part of that same issue.

i will stick to this for now and not even "go there" with his deplorable conduct.   'foolish black woman'!!!!!!   ....that will be dealt with in due course

[sisMenenI]

To you this might be an appropriate response and conduct given that the writer professes to "sight Selassie" according to a comment you made the other day. But in my view the response only shows that the initial points raised to his distorted notions were in fact quite legitimate.


This is the comment that was challenged, and Rootka Zebulun's initial comment and response clearly shows that he is delusional.

You said that the response by Kelani is slanderous, which I am yet to see, and after reading both responses I see that you are also quite prepared to tolerate and accept any kind of vile delusional conduct once the person "sight Selassie" according to your view. This to me just exposes the real problem even more.

Ayinde, do you consider yourself a "Rastaman"?? This debating turns from reasoning and makes this place like some kind of Rasta trial in a courthouse... "the response only shows that the initial points raised to his distorted notions were in fact quite legitimate."  If your main focus in life is on the current states of the world and racism, why are you always posting against His Majesty? Tearing down Rastafari? Trying to prove it delusional? Why not live for the [i]upliftment [/i[/u]]and let InI Rastafari keep forwarding without constantly reading the nit picking of InI faith and knowing, without someone's post getting douple posted to prove them delusional... Judgement.
May JahJah bless you with health, more love and guidance.

[Ayinde]

Ayinde, do you consider yourself a "Rastaman"??

I consider myself many things and Rasta is just one definition. I hold fast to my own definitions of myself and I do not readily adopt other people's narrow definitions of themselves.

If your main focus in life is on the current states of the world and racism, why are you always posting against His Majesty? Tearing down Rastafari? Trying to prove it delusional?

I really doubt that you know my main focus in life but here again you draw these distorted conclusions from your own biases. You should review my comments on the thread: [link=http://www.africaspeaks.com/reasoning/?board=hot;action=display;num=1066056053]Selassie's Denial Of Being The Messiah[/link]

Nowhere in these threads have I ever denied anyone from expressing opposing views on Haile Selassie but I reserve the right to oppose any view that is directly or indirectly against myself.

This is a reasoning forum and I feel no need to answer every question thrown from any poster. I do not have any particular need to justify my presence here. Several times we have experienced on these boards, White and near-white posters pretending to be Black and commenting for the sole purpose of distracting from issues. So I do not buy all the distractions as legitimate concerns.

Express yourself.

Ayinde.

[Bantu_Kelani]

Ayinde, do you consider yourself a "Rastaman"?? This debating turns from reasoning and makes this place like some kind of Rasta trial in a courthouse... "the response only shows that the initial points raised to his distorted notions were in fact quite legitimate."  If your main focus in life is on the current states of the world and racism, why are you always posting against His Majesty? Tearing down Rastafari? Trying to prove it delusional? Why not live for the [i]upliftment [/i[/u]]and let InI Rastafari keep forwarding without constantly reading the nit picking of InI faith and knowing, without someone's post getting douple posted to prove them delusional... Judgement.
May JahJah bless you with health, more love and guidance.

Rastafari is supposed to stand for Black structural and ideological JUSTICE. In handling the task we must consider the FACTS, so why so much DENIAL and IGNORANCE? Even when presented with proof and evidence so-called Rastafarians will not acknowledge and accept them, your attitude uplift whites and discriminate blacks in the process. Your Romantic positions preserve the status quo of white privilege for you have no concern or solution to Black people  oppression but to just say "ignore it", "we should just get over it"..

Your approach reminds me of the European colonialists who came to Africa. In one hand is the Bible and the other hand is the gun. You are replicating in one hand the Kebra Negast and the other arrogant delusion. What is actually ORIGINAL in the Rastafari religion with its male deity symbolism and creeds, subsequent of male chauvinistic Hebrew beliefs also cherished by the advocates of Christianity?

We the broad-minded Africans believe in the indigenous spirituality of our ancestors, as taught to them by their OWN belief systems.  Black Africans won't get anywhere as a people if we won't EXPAND OUR VISION and realize that there are concrete issues that need to be addressed, like the high black unemployment rate, incarceration rate and poverty rate that affects and concerns way more Africans than odes to Haile Selaissie I. Prove your progressive mindset and interest for black people by addressing relevant issues in general and not just castigate the Black woman or man who chose to do so.  


Bantu-Kelani.