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25515 Posts in 9752 Topics by 980 Members Latest Member: - Roots Dawta Most online today: 59 (July 03, 2005, 11:25:30 PM)
+  Africa Speaks Reasoning Forum
|-+  GENERAL
| |-+  Leanna (Moderator: Leanna)
| | |-+  Classist or Having Standards
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Author Topic: Classist or Having Standards  (Read 4993 times)
Leanna
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« on: November 25, 2014, 02:13:48 AM »

In examining my own decisions classist attitudes and having standards seems to be hard to separate.At least for me because persons don't entertain or welcome everyone that approaches them in their space or lives. Not only in terms of looking for a partner but friendships as well. So some of these standards we have for ourselves may be seen as classist so it's hard to tell when it stops being about having standards and being classist. What is the difference?
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Iniko Ujaama
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« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2014, 10:15:54 AM »

Quote
persons don't entertain or welcome everyone that approaches them in their space or lives

Indeed this is true. I don't think people do or should welcome just anyone into their space or lives. People use a number of different factors to make this determination. Can you share the standards or rather criteria on which you base this determination?
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Amanda
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« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2014, 12:11:42 AM »

Firstly, those standards you refer to are they indeed yours or society's? Also, can you indicate what your standards are?
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Leanna
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« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2014, 03:45:41 AM »


Iniko Ujaama,

The criteria or 'standards' which I use differs depending on the situation, however generally it is dependent on the way individuals address me
1. The manner in which they choose to get my attention, for eg pstt or whistling family ect I would not even respond to I am more welcoming to a good morning/good afternoon
2. The topic of conversations they choose to engage in.
3. How the person speaks excessive use of slang tends to be unappealing. (don't get me wrong 'standard English' is not a must normal trini dialect is fine I myself use this in everyday conversation)
4. Life goals or purpose of that individual is important I do not wish to have relations with persons that is not trying to better themselves or have some goal they are working towards persons who are just existing. I find myself having friendships with persons who are working towards something whatever that may be. This usually is that the person is pursuing a formal education or has a career and career goals and working on that and I do have friends that aren't pursing or have ever been to a tertiary institution but I've recognized that I value formal education. These are basically it there may be others but this is what comes to mind.   

And to Amanda, 'the standards' are listed and I think it is a combination of both.
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Amanda
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« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2014, 09:40:20 AM »

Leanna, would you enter into a relationship with someone who has not been formally educated? and why will you or why wont you?
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Leanna
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« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2014, 10:51:02 PM »

Yes I would, I have before. I would because there are other factors like life goals, career path etc. That doesn't require having a formal education (meaning from tertiary onward). Also if the person has the knowledge to have meaningful conversations ( that is beyond everyday 'small talk' like how was your day, the weather and what you had for lunch).
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Amanda
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« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2014, 09:46:45 AM »

Yes i agree with you there, people should definitely bring more to the table then mere casual dialogue, you indicated that people do not need to have a formal education to have goals and a career path which is also true, in the event someone is interested in you but they have never been to Secondary school or had to stop mid way during primary school, would you give them a chance and value them like you would a formally educated person? bear in mind, in this instance the individual engages in meaningful conversation ( based on your definition of such), has life goals and a career path but it is not in alignment with mainstream society's idea of a 'good' job ( currently an assembly line worker).
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Nakandi
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« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2014, 08:40:39 AM »

Leanna, how do you define classism?
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Leanna
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« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2014, 12:57:27 AM »

KiwNak,
I would define it as valuing and treating people based on their social and economic class. How would you?
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Amanda
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« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2014, 03:13:33 AM »

Recently,  a guy asked me to accompany him to a Christmas dinner at his job and one of the things that came to mind was his place of employment, i am very ashamed to admit that his occupation was an issue for me. I did not dwell on it for long, but the mere fact that it came to mind and i had to think about it a couple of times, clearly indicates that i myself have some unaddressed issues to work on, one of which deals with treating and thinking of people differently based on their economic status.
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leslie
Leslie
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AfricaSpeaks


« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2014, 02:51:18 PM »

It is good to witness the progression of this dialogue which is revealing that there is no clear distinction between "having standards" and classism.

One should be very cautious about this notion of “Having standards” as it is usually centered on long-standing classism, racism, sexism, colourism, size discrimination and other biases. It is also predicated upon closeness to European standards of etiquette, material positions and manner of speech among other things. When people talk about “having standards”, it is usually not properly thought out but instead, borne out of the internalization of the aforementioned biases. Thus, people often use “having standards” –an exercise in self-delusion – to shun and scorn others and use it as a basis to justify and sugarcoat their racism, classism et cetera.

The best way to demonstrate “having standards” is by constantly and deliberately working to refine one’s character.  That is the kind of standard that is most valuable.
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Leanna
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« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2014, 08:20:44 PM »

Amanda,
To answer your question posted a couple days ago about me giving this person a chance, I have thought about it and the honest answer is no. I delayed answering because I have recognized exactly how much of these nasty classist attitudes that I do have and was very ashamed. I thought it quite difficult to putting my nasty attitudes out there. Another reason is now being aware of the truth that I am in fact classist, I decided not to post because although I am aware of these things I still would not be in a relationship with that individual, i would be speak to the individual but I will not value them as I would a formally educated person or someone with a good career as defined by society. I do hold these factors in high esteem and I just can't get around to wanting a relationship with someone that does not fit that. This is not something I am proud of, I do wish to be better than having these attitudes but for now I just cannot see a way around them. How then does one address these issues?   
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Amanda
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« Reply #12 on: December 03, 2014, 01:40:46 AM »

Leanna,
It is indeed refreshing that you are being honest with yourself thats a good start. You indicated that, you thought about the question i posed to you and subsequently came to the realization that you would not give someone of that description a chance however, in my opinion, i believe you knew that from the beginning and thinking about it just made you feel horrible inside which inevitably led to your delayed response. It is no easy task to simply treat persons based on merit as opposed to treating them based on their various privileges but it is very possible, you certainly cannot do it on your own since people cannot judge tbeir behavior and character objectively therefore, you should interact with persons who are more experienced than you are to get a better sense of the best way forward. Of course, your conditioning is not easy to eliminate since it has been shaped by history and reinforced through different mediums of socialization. Yes, despite being aware of your 'nastiness'it is still challenging to act based on the truth, i myself have struggled on numerous occasions with similar situations and have failed miserably since i hold in high esteem features and components of the 'ideal' type very closely. In addition to interacting with those more experienced than you are, bear in mind consistency is critical therefore, you constantly need to check your attitude towards others. If you do find another way of addressing these issues please share them with me since i have a lot to deal with.
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